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Ukraine War Poll

The Blood

By The Blood
in Political Forum

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Ukraine War Poll  

29 members have voted

  1. 1. Which country do you believe is in the moral right in the Ukraine conflict?

    • Russia
      0
    • Ukraine
      27
    • Neither/No opinion
      2

  2. 2. Do you support Western funding and arms going to support Ukraine?

  3. 3. Do you support Western sanctions on Russia?

  4. 4. What is your preferred outcome for the war?

    • Total Russian victory - Eastern Ukraine is annexed into Russia while a pro-Putin puppet regime is established in western Ukraine.
      0
    • Negotiated settlement - Ukraine surrenders all areas with a majority Russian population to Russia, while the Zelensky government survives and maintains rule over the rest of Ukraine.
      1
    • Negotiated settlement - Pre-invasion borders are maintained, with both sides conceding claims over territory and conceding to a draw.
      6
    • Total Ukrainian victory - All of Donbas and Crimea are returned to Ukrainian ownership, Putin regime collapses.
      22
    • I support a different outcome(state below)
      0

  5. 5. Who do you think will win the war?

    • Russia
      1
    • Ukraine
      10
    • Neither - Some sort of negotiated settlement will be reached with neither side achieving all of their goals
      18

  6. 6. How much longer do you believe the Putin regime will last?

  7. 7. Who do you believe should preside over potential peace negotiations?

    • Russia and Ukraine should hash out terms on their own
      8
    • The United States
      3
    • The European Union/An EU member such as France
      6
    • China
      0
    • A third party completely uninvolved with the war
      6
    • The United Nations
      6

  8. 8. Do you approve or disapprove of Volodymyr Zelensky?

    • Strongly approve
      9
    • Approve
      12
    • Indifferent
      6
    • Disapprove
      1
    • Strongly disapprove
      1

  9. 9. Do you approve or disapprove of Vladimir Putin?

    • Strongly approve
      0
    • Approve
      0
    • Indifferent
      1
    • Disapprove
      2
    • Strongly disapprove
      26

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Rodja

Rodja

Posted
Posted

Just to clarify on the issue of sanctions,i disapprove of the ways sanctions are handled in the modern geopolitics in a way they harm normal people more than bloodthirsty dictators who started the war.

This is not the war of Russian people,this is war started by Putin and his cronies and they should pay the price.

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MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
Posted
On 9/21/2022 at 4:30 AM, Rodja said:

Just to clarify on the issue of sanctions,i disapprove of the ways sanctions are handled in the modern geopolitics in a way they harm normal people more than bloodthirsty dictators who started the war.

This is not the war of Russian people,this is war started by Putin and his cronies and they should pay the price.

How do you propose Putin and his cronies be punished in a manner that does not impact the Russian people?

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Rodja

Rodja

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, MrPotatoTed said:

How do you propose Putin and his cronies be punished in a manner that does not impact the Russian people?

Forbid entrance to America and other NATO countries to them and all their closer family members,freezing bank accounts and other financial assets they might have in other countries,etc.

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DakotaHale

DakotaHale

Posted
Posted

Corrupt authoritarian dipshit vs corrupt authoritarian dipshit. Don't really have a dog in the fight, I support whatever outcome ends the war the soonest (besides nukes preferably). Would like to see both regimes deposed. I don't support Russia or Ukraine, but rather Russians and Ukranians. Sad to see a people who share a similar culture and ancestry fight over nothing.

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Hestia

Hestia

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, DakotaHale said:

Corrupt authoritarian dipshit vs corrupt authoritarian dipshit. Don't really have a dog in the fight, I support whatever outcome ends the war the soonest (besides nukes preferably). Would like to see both regimes deposed. I don't support Russia or Ukraine, but rather Russians and Ukranians. Sad to see a people who share a similar culture and ancestry fight over nothing.

Regardless of your thoughts on the leaders, it's pretty clear who is being mistreated. To think they're equal is a complete and utter farce. Unless you think that more Izyums and Buchas should happen to the Ukrainian people, any Ukrainian land remaining under Russia at the end of the war will result in horrific mistreatment, murder, rape and other atrocities. That's not a fight over nothing. That's a fight for survival. Russia has started it over nothing, if that's what you mean. Anything else is gross misdirection about what has actually occurred in this war. 

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The Blood

The Blood

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, DakotaHale said:

Corrupt authoritarian dipshit vs corrupt authoritarian dipshit. Don't really have a dog in the fight, I support whatever outcome ends the war the soonest (besides nukes preferably). Would like to see both regimes deposed. I don't support Russia or Ukraine, but rather Russians and Ukranians. Sad to see a people who share a similar culture and ancestry fight over nothing.

To be fair, while I admit that Zelensky has his faults, he is far above his predecessors in terms of quality, and the explicit goal of his presidency has been to move Ukraine closer to the liberal democracies of the West. And on that note, Zelensky is a democratically elected leader, unlike Putin.

Edited by The Blood
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ShortKing

ShortKing

Posted
Posted

I'm also just wary of the sentiment that the war just needs to end. The war's only gone on this long because Ukraine refuses to go down without a fight. Orwell has that quote that the quickest way to end a war is to lose it and I think the Ukrainian people have made clear that they'd rather fight this war out to defend their sovereignty, however long it may take. 

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DakotaHale

DakotaHale

Posted
Posted
40 minutes ago, The Blood said:

To be fair, while I admit that Zelensky has his faults, he is far above his predecessors in terms of quality, and the explicit goal of his presidency has been to move Ukraine closer to the liberal democracies of the West. And on that note, Zelensky is a democratically elected leader, unlike Putin.

I agree, he's certainly better than the pro-Russian parties in Ukraine. Still one of the most blatantly corrupt regimes in Europe and has not become a freer nation under Zelensky (even before the war, in case you think the stripping of civil liberties and freedom is justified in war). Ukraine has the most off-shore accounts in the world (which I'm sure a significant part of the terribly-audited financial aid has gone), and Zelensky himself and many of his associates in government were implicated for money laundering. He's a schmuck and a fraud, and I will say he's better than Putin, but that's a low bar for anybody.

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DakotaHale

DakotaHale

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, ShortKing said:

I'm also just wary of the sentiment that the war just needs to end. The war's only gone on this long because Ukraine refuses to go down without a fight. Orwell has that quote that the quickest way to end a war is to lose it and I think the Ukrainian people have made clear that they'd rather fight this war out to defend their sovereignty, however long it may take. 

The longer the war drags on the more lives that are lost on both sides and the more leverage Ukraine loses (because it's impossible for Ukraine to win outright, pushing into mainland Russia would mean nuclear war, they don't have the amphibious invasion capabilities to take back Crimea with their shit Navy, which Russia may also consider a mainland territory by now. Russia isn't fully mobilized, has a more modern air force, is outshelling Ukraine by a factor of 10, and other factors which lead me to suggest that Ukraine's leverage is at its peak right now). And honestly I wouldn't be surprised if Zelensky was only giving tough comments to the media but was working around-the-clock behind the scenes to secure a peace deal while 80% of Ukraine is still under government control.

As much as I would love to see a NATO-aligned country push into Moscow and give the middle finger to Russia and the rest of the CSTO, it's not going to happen. A status-quo settlement would and should be the hope for Ukraine. Or a sudden death from Putin and hope that a more benevolent, liberal leader takes his place who would be willing to end the war on good terms, but from what I've seen US and EU intelligence have no suspicions that Putin is terminally ill despite rumors from the beginning of the war, but now that makes me wonder how good of a strategy it would be to go on the defensive the entire time and try to bankrupt Russia/outlast Putin. Hmm...

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Hestia

Hestia

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, DakotaHale said:

The longer the war drags on the more lives that are lost on both sides and the more leverage Ukraine loses (because it's impossible for Ukraine to win outright, pushing into mainland Russia would mean nuclear war, they don't have the amphibious invasion capabilities to take back Crimea with their shit Navy, which Russia may also consider a mainland territory by now. Russia isn't fully mobilized, has a more modern air force, is outshelling Ukraine by a factor of 10, and other factors which lead me to suggest that Ukraine's leverage is at its peak right now)

I think you aren't paying attention enough to come to these conclusions. I doubt Ukraine will attempt to take Crimea back by force and will simply block it off if they can regain Kherson oblast - that may be an area that they will concede in exchange for other areas. Russia lost at least four aircraft today. They are not at their peak by any means and a lot of factors are pointing to a prolonged counteroffensive in Luhansk oblast as Lyman is nearly surrounded and Svatove is being approached. Ukraine's forces are more modern - HIMARs, Javelins, etc. They captured a large contingent of Russian equipment in the Kharkiv counteroffensive. I think you're fundamentally misunderstanding the current situation to claim that their leverage has peaked. There's reporting that Putin himself got in charge of the war effort to order his commanders to stay in Kherson - which shows that they are clearly on the back foot there as well.

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Hestia

Hestia

Posted
Posted
On 9/24/2022 at 9:21 PM, Hestia said:

I think you aren't paying attention enough to come to these conclusions. I doubt Ukraine will attempt to take Crimea back by force and will simply block it off if they can regain Kherson oblast - that may be an area that they will concede in exchange for other areas. Russia lost at least four aircraft today. They are not at their peak by any means and a lot of factors are pointing to a prolonged counteroffensive in Luhansk oblast as Lyman is nearly surrounded and Svatove is being approached. Ukraine's forces are more modern - HIMARs, Javelins, etc. They captured a large contingent of Russian equipment in the Kharkiv counteroffensive. I think you're fundamentally misunderstanding the current situation to claim that their leverage has peaked. There's reporting that Putin himself got in charge of the war effort to order his commanders to stay in Kherson - which shows that they are clearly on the back foot there as well.

And...today we have reports of Russian defense lines in Lyman collapsing. Dominoes falling back in the opposite direction. 

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Hestia

Hestia

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Zenobiyl said:

In the sense of begrudging respect for his ability to strengthen Russia geopolitically and remain in power for so long.

So in your overall feeling for him the begrudging respect for remaining in power so long balances out against war crimes and nuclear threats? Not even mentioning how quickly their army has been exposed. 

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Pringles

Pringles

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, DakotaHale said:

Crazy how they've had so many shitty leaders since the revolution and are still a major power.

Don't blame me, I voted for Bukharin.

Don’t blame me I actually voted for the guy who SHOULD symbolize Russia these days…. Boris Yeltsin.

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Pringles

Pringles

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Pringles said:

Don’t blame me I actually voted for the guy who SHOULD symbolize Russia these days…. Boris Yeltsin.

Rumor says Yeltsins ghost was driving that take in the video where it ran over some soldiers and knocked a tree down.

vodka cyka

Edited by Pringles
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