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Revisiting 2020 - Primaries

The Blood

By The Blood
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Revisiting 2020 - Primaries  

19 members have voted

  1. 1. Assuming You Were An Eligible Primary Voter At The Time, Who Would You Vote For In The 2020 Democratic Presidential Primaries?

    • Joe Biden
      2
    • Bernie Sanders
      6
    • Elizabeth Warren
      2
    • Mike Bloomberg
      0
    • Pete Buttigieg
      1
    • Amy Klobuchar
      0
    • Tom Steyer
      0
    • Tulsi Gabbard
      0
    • Andrew Yang
      3
    • Deval Patrick
      0
    • Michael Bennet
      0
    • John Delaney
      1
    • Cory Booker
      0
    • Marianne Williamson
      1
    • Julián Castro
      1
    • Kamala Harris
      1
    • Steve Bullock
      0
    • Joe Sestak
      0
    • Wayne Messam
      0
    • Beto O'Rourke
      0
    • Tim Ryan
      0
    • Bill de Blasio
      0
    • Kirsten Gillibrand
      0
    • Seth Moulton
      0
    • Jay Inslee
      0
    • John Hickenlooper
      0
    • Mike Gravel
      1
    • Eric Swalwell
      0
    • Richard Ojeda
      0

  2. 2. Assuming You Were An Eligible Primary Voter At The Time, Who Would You Vote For In The 2020 Republican Presidential Primaries?

    • Donald Trump
      0
    • Bill Weld
      10
    • Joe Walsh
      4
    • Mark Sanford
      0
    • Rocky De La Fuente
      5

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The Blood

The Blood

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Hello everyone! Just making this poll to pick the forum’s brain on the 2020 Election. First we’ll be going through the primaries for the Republicans and Dems, and after we have a winner in each contest we can move on to the General Election. Thank you!

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The Blood

The Blood

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(Assuming no candidate hits 50% in one primary or another, I may decide to hold a runoff poll between the top two vote-getters, but that's tbd)

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Hestia

Hestia

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14 minutes ago, Patine said:

Russia, Belarus, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Uganda, Zimbabwe, and the United States - nations where votes against the incumbent establishment partisan system are institutionally assumed wasted in a rigged system. Are you proud of your nation standing with those other examples, there?

Yes

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Zenobiyl

Zenobiyl

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17 minutes ago, Patine said:

Russia, Belarus, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Uganda, Zimbabwe, and the United States - nations where votes against the incumbent establishment partisan system are institutionally assumed wasted in a rigged system. Are you proud of your nation standing with those other examples, there?

Yes

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Timur

Timur

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26 minutes ago, Patine said:

What if I would have voted Third Party if I had been eligible to vote?

Which party, pray tell?

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Timur

Timur

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17 minutes ago, Patine said:

Russia, Belarus, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Uganda, Zimbabwe, and the United States - nations where votes against the incumbent establishment partisan system are institutionally assumed wasted in a rigged system. Are you proud of your nation standing with those other examples, there?

Well, at least the US system, flawed as it is, is better than the North Korean system.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_North_Korean_parliamentary_election

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Timur

Timur

Posted
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3 minutes ago, Timur said:

Well, at least the US system, flawed as it is, is better than the North Korean system.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_North_Korean_parliamentary_election

And North Korea's newspaper actually claims that their election system is "the most superior in the world." (!!!)

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Timur

Timur

Posted
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3 minutes ago, Patine said:

That's a rotten comparison, you know. In the Democracy index Rating, where Iceland is number one, North Korea is dead last, at 156 of 156 rated counties. EVERY country in the world has a better system that North Korea!

Well the US is #25

 

Russia is #124

Belarus is #148

Kazakhstan is #128

Uganda is #98

Zimbabwe is #127

Azerbaijan is #146

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The Blood

The Blood

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31 minutes ago, Patine said:

What if I would have voted Third Party if I had been eligible to vote?

Then you can decide to not participate in the poll, as the two-party system is the established means for Presidents to be elected in the US, and I'm only polling within that system due to the non-importance of third parties in 2020 and most Presidential Elections. 

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Pringles

Pringles

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29 minutes ago, Patine said:

Russia, Belarus, Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Uganda, Zimbabwe, and the United States - nations where votes against the incumbent establishment partisan system are institutionally assumed wasted in a rigged system. Are you proud of your nation standing with those other examples, there?

Yes

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Pringles

Pringles

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5 minutes ago, Timur said:

Well the US is #25

 

Russia is #124

Belarus is #148

Kazakhstan is #128

Uganda is #98

Zimbabwe is #127

Azerbaijan is #146

Man we're in the top 20%. I'd say that's pretty damn good tbh. 😛 

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Timur

Timur

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1 minute ago, Zenobiyl said:

You might get your wish for a third party @Patine if Trump gets primaried and Bernie wins the dem primary.

I sometimes wondered what a four-way-race would be like: Progressives, Establishment Democrats, Never-Trumpers, Trumpists

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Timur

Timur

Posted
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3 minutes ago, Patine said:

I am also really hoping the U.S. leaves the Dotards (Trump, Biden, and Sanders - and Clinton as well, she's no spring chicken, either) behind in 2024, and moves on to new leaders and new ideas and new visions...

*grimly* and pigs will fly... 😬

The strange fascination Americans have towards eldery statesmen.

Joe Biden = currently 78

Bernie Sanders = currently 79

Elizabeth Warren = currently 71

Donald Trump = currently 74

Hilary Clinton = currently 73

Nancy Pelosi = currently 81

Mitch McConnell = currently 79

 

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MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
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16 minutes ago, Patine said:

Given some of your past posts on the matter, and other nations' electoral systems, I think you're being sarcastic here. But I honestly believe @MrPotatoTed believes solid Duopoly control of the American electoral system and the inability of Third Party and Independent candidates to be meaningful, and the fact that both major parties agree on more than they disagree on - including the biggest crimes, betrayals, abuses of power, and corruption by the U.S. Government, all supported solidly, as somehow good things, except MAYBE the corruption, by @MrPotatoTed - should retain their grip on power indefinitely, and never receive a challenge or political change. But a change is sorely needed.

Actually, my view on this is the thing that I've actually said about this before -- not this new thing that you present as my opinion here.

There are many reasons that the two party system has largely survived (in one iteration or another) for basically the length of American history.  Yes, in part, it's because of the money they've raised and the rules the two parties have managed to institute -- but that doesn't matter, because both parties have public primaries that force them to adapt.  You think Republican party leadership WANTED Donald Trump in 2016?  Or that the Democrat Party leadership were thrilled to see Bernie making huge strides in both 2016 and 2020, pulling the party to the left?  Of course not.  But, both parties adapted, because they have to in order to survive.

You don't need a revolution if you have the power to work the system to your advantage. Trump and Bernie both, for better or worse, proved that it is extremely doable.  

You don't have to dismantle our entire election system.  You just have to convince voters to vote for you -- the same as if you were a member of any other party imaginable, but with the added benefit that if you actually pull it off, the top two parties have the money to actually get you elected.

 

2 minutes ago, Patine said:

I am also really hoping the U.S. leaves the Dotards (Trump, Biden, and Sanders - and Clinton as well, she's no spring chicken, either) behind in 2024, and moves on to new leaders and new ideas and new visions...

*grimly* and pigs will fly... 😬

Awesome!  Glad to have your support!  #Pete2024  ;c)

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Timur

Timur

Posted
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Just now, Patine said:

Still, the system does reek far too much of the incumbent parties controlling what in many other countries are non-partisan electoral agencies, regulators, and courts - effectively the crimes of electoral malfeasance and interference (which the alleged Russian hackers of 2016 were accused of) by agents working on the payroll of the DNC, RNC, and other incumbent party organs every election. These are SERIOUS crimes and betrayals of the trust I remind you! Also, the way the Primary system works is so winding, unrepresentative, and easily manipulatable that the true value of whether nominee truly has the support of the party is very dubious. Not to mention that, after the Primary bottleneck is done, many voters feel alienated and that they have no candidate to support with any enthusiasm in the GE. This is why the U.S. has a much lower average voter turnout rate compared to First World Nations with multi-party systems. And, the institutional suppression of Third Parties and Independents is still, at the end of the day, and abuse of incumbent power and an act of, "soft," tyranny.

How do you suggest primaries should be done?

(Also, I think that all primaries should be closed primaries. Democrats helped Trump get elected by secretly voting for him in the primaries)

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MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
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2 minutes ago, Timur said:

How do you suggest primaries should be done?

(Also, I think that all primaries should be closed primaries. Democrats helped Trump get elected by secretly voting for him in the primaries)

...what?  

We have open primaries in Ohio.  That's why Kasich won despite flopping everywhere else -- Democrats voted for Kasich in a failed attempt to stop Trump from reaching the necessary number of delegates.

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Timur

Timur

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Just now, MrPotatoTed said:

...what?  

We have open primaries in Ohio.  That's why Kasich won despite flopping everywhere else -- Democrats voted for Kasich in a failed attempt to stop Trump from reaching the necessary number of delegates.

https://www.cnbc.com/2016/03/22/trumps-big-advantage-open-primaries.html

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Timur

Timur

Posted
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Timur said:

https://www.cnbc.com/2016/03/22/trumps-big-advantage-open-primaries.html

I also remember reading that Trump urged Democrats to register as Republicans...

If you look at the polls at that time, Trump was seen as the least likely to win against Clinton. (Unless you count the strangely Pro-Trump Morning Consult polls)

Edited by Timur
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MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

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3 minutes ago, Patine said:

 

Also, being, "registered," as a, "member," of a political party when you are not actually involved as a party bureaucrat, ideologue, advertiser/propagandist, committee member, candidate, or other politician or other member of the party machinery (where you would have a party membership card in most parliamentary systems), but just by, "mass registration," has always struck me as just a bit Orwellian, and a backdoor violation of the secret ballot.

You're confusing elections with primaries.  General elections are established by law.  Primary procedures are largely established by party.

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