Hestia Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 Just now, Mishfox said: Those words mean the same thing to anyone living outside the capitalist bubble of American politics No they don't, which shows how little understanding of political ideology you have. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mishfox Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, Pringles said: And where do they get their food from? What happens when it runs out? From communal farmers. The food won’t run out, this is just another “COMMUNISM FAMINE!!!!!!” Argument that has been debunked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hestia Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 Just now, Patine said: But, if such a plan were made, declaring war on China and Russia would have to be as a real danger - a danger enough, that such a Government may be unforgivably gambling their nation, people, and the world they're in as a very real threat - possibly even enough that removing such a Hellbent Administration and Congress from power - even extralegally - before they can pull the trigger on such an Apocalypse may even be justified, correct? I agree. I think that such a plan should only and only go into force if the US is absolutely certain a nuclear warhead is heading to say, Hawaii. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVProgressive Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Hestia said: There are tons of plans created by the government and Pentagon officials that are there *in case they are needed*. Not every plan is made with the intent of actually putting it into motion. Come on now Hestia, don't you remember when America invaded the Azores islands? 😛 https://research.archives.gov/description/2989849 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVProgressive Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 18 minutes ago, Patine said: Such twisted logic. These, "alliances," are why the assassination of Franz Ferdinand turned from a dispute between Austria-Hungary and Serbia to the most nightmarish war in history. Sure, but I would counter that alliances in the modern day prevent more major wars than they cause. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVProgressive Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Patine said: It just means that the low-hanging, un-allied fruit nations (Iraq, Afghanistan, the Republic of Georgia, Artsakh, Kurdistan, Palestine, Lebanon, Mali, Gabon, the Cote d'Ivoire, etc.) just get picked on by bigger powers instead. It just enables international bullying. 😬 Well, what would you prefer? A world in which the 10 or so strongest nations are able to bully all of the other nations without recourse? That's realistically what a world without alliances would devolve into. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eugene Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 18 minutes ago, Mishfox said: Typical conservative “humor” The only thing less conservative than me is your mom’s dress code which lead to you being conceived, although it is sad that your father could be one of 10 different men. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hestia Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 5 minutes ago, Patine said: gung ho fight for our allies head on," Most people would regard this a positive thing 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hestia Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 3 minutes ago, Patine said: Not when a fair number of your allies are dubious, fairweather, one-sided, and/or tails that wag the dog, and the war you're charging into has the potential to wipe out all life on Earth. Then one's intelligence and sanity should be checked. Europe is full of good allies, South Korea, Japan, Israel, large parts of South America (even if their govts are bad, their people mean well). No one should be free to be oppressed simply because you think "they're a tail that wags the dog". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Blood Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 Me not checking the forum for most of the day and coming back to this is why we can't have nice things. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Blood Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 2 hours ago, Mishfox said: Another “moderate” Biden voter Also, bud, are you using "Biden voter" as an insult here? I can literally see you browsing Reddit and getting your takes from some of the subs there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mishfox Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 6 minutes ago, The Blood said: Also, bud, are you using "Biden voter" as an insult here? I can literally see you browsing Reddit and getting your takes from some of the subs there. The Biden Voter™ (AKA low information voter) is someone who gets all their info from CNN and mainstream media. They support Biden over candidates who will actually help America like Bernie because they’ve been told socialism = bad their entire life. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rezi Posted June 20, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted June 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Mishfox said: The Biden Voter™ (AKA low information voter) is someone who gets all their info from CNN and mainstream media. They support Biden over candidates who will actually help America like Bernie because they’ve been told socialism = bad their entire life. Damn who knew that every Biden voter is just an uninformed idiot who doesn’t know how to think for themselves? 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mishfox Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 3 minutes ago, Patine said: To be fair, Bernie Sanders is a Social Democrat, not a full-out Socialist (at least not anymore). He's much more in line with the New Democratic Party of Canada, the New Zealand Labor Party, the Labor Party of Israel, the Parti Socialiste, the Social Democratic Party of Germany, the Labour Party of Norway, the Labour Party of Ireland, etc. (the Australian Labor Party and the Social Democratic Party of Austria moved too far to the right, the Labour Party of the UK did so under Blair and Brown, and then went sharply to the left under Corbyn, and I'm not clear on where they stand now). But, I certainly agree that Sanders is a far better candidate than Biden, but the U.S. electoral and political is so wretched that every first Tuesday of November I am thankful for not being eligible to vote down there. Well yeah. Ideally there would be a real socialist but Bernie is a good first step. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post The Blood Posted June 20, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted June 20, 2021 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Mishfox said: The Biden Voter™ (AKA low information voter) is someone who gets all their info from CNN and mainstream media. They support Biden over candidates who will actually help America like Bernie because they’ve been told socialism = bad their entire life. From what I've seen Pringles is a politically aware person who keeps at least some tabs on current events. But of course, he must be getting all of his information from the "liberal(fascist) media", so obviously that means he's just a slave to corporate America, at least in your mind. Look, I'm just going to fucking say it, you aren't gaining anything by having these deeply concerning arguments on this forum. I get it, you're young, you feel as though you're standing up for what's right, but in reality you're just being influenced by people with deeply distorted worldviews online. People who post threads including attempts to "debunk" the very real oppressions being inflicted by the North Korean government. People who scream all day about the grand, elite conspiracy to string Americans along through the media and the "liberals" who fall as servants to them. People who call well-informed individuals, those who keep up with the politics of today, "low-information" because they listen to the most trustworthy sources available(Though they have their clear biases) and voted for the man who was the only alternative we had to an authoritarian narcissist leading our nation down a very dark path. Look, all I'm saying is that I know you're young, and I know you just want to fight for what's right, we all do, but I hope you look back on these arguments in a decade and have a more stable worldview than the one you've demonstrated countless times on this forum. Edited June 20, 2021 by The Blood 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hestia Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 20 minutes ago, Mishfox said: The Biden Voter™ (AKA low information voter) is someone who gets all their info from CNN and mainstream media. They support Biden over candidates who will actually help America like Bernie because they’ve been told socialism = bad their entire life. Wow, painting in broad strokes much? Hate to know what you'd say about actual Republicans. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mishfox Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, Hestia said: Wow, painting in broad strokes much? Hate to know what you'd say about actual Republicans. They are fascists 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mishfox Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 8 minutes ago, The Blood said: From what I've seen Pringles is a politically aware person who keeps at least some tabs on current events. But of course, he must be getting all of his information from the "liberal(fascist) media", so obviously that means he's just a slave to corporate America, at least in your mind. Look, I'm just going to fucking say it, you aren't gaining anything by having these deeply concerning arguments on this forum. I get it, you're young, you feel as though you're standing up for what's right, but in reality you're just being influenced by people with deeply distorted worldviews online. People who post threads including attempts to "debunk" the very real oppressions being inflicted by the North Korean government. People who scream all day about the grand, elite conspiracy to string Americans along through the media and the "liberals" who fall as servants to them. People who call well-informed individuals, those who keep up with the politics of today, "low-information" because they listen to the most trustworthy sources available(Though they have their clear biases) and voted for the man who was the only alternative we had to an authoritarian narcissist leading our nation down a very dark path. Look, all I'm saying is that I know you're young, and I know you just want to fight for what's right, we all do, but I hope you look back on these arguments in a decade and have a more stable worldview than the one you've demonstrated countless times on this forum. If I become a Biden voter in a decade from now just shoot me 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, Mishfox said: They are fascists I think, despite the direction of the Republican Party being absolutely shit right now, I once identified entirely with them. Am I a Fascist? I'm pretty sure of all the people on this forum, nobody but you would refer to me, or another Republican as fascist. When I was in middle school I also had my populist, Bernie Bro-Trumpist phase. A bit different from what you subscribe to currently I believe. What opened me up to the faults of populism was a conversation with a friend and some research of my own. In 1933, left wing and right wing authoritarian populism united in the Weimar Republic. That produced Hitler. What opened me up to the faults of socialism, and especially was Communism was visiting Eastern Europe and listening as a young adult to the stories of my family. Half of them lived under Communism for large portions of their lives. You can bring up your typical excuse of red fascist, but you know that's a farce. Because Communism can never be achieved without ushering in an authoritarian state to enforce compliance within the system. Please, stop with the r/communism talking points. MAKE YOUR OWN TALKING POINTS. WITH YOUR OWN MIND. I sincerely mean this when I say I hope you reconsider your thought on the universe some day. That is all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mishfox Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 7 minutes ago, Pringles said: I think, despite the direction of the Republican Party being absolutely shit right now, I once identified entirely with them. Am I a Fascist? I'm pretty sure of all the people on this forum, nobody but you would refer to me, or another Republican as fascist. When I was in middle school I also had my populist, Bernie Bro-Trumpist phase. A bit different from what you subscribe to currently I believe. What opened me up to the faults of populism was a conversation with a friend and some research of my own. In 1933, left wing and right wing authoritarian populism united in the Weimar Republic. That produced Hitler. What opened me up to the faults of socialism, and especially was Communism was visiting Eastern Europe and listening as a young adult to the stories of my family. Half of them lived under Communism for large portions of their lives. You can bring up your typical excuse of red fascist, but you know that's a farce. Because Communism can never be achieved without ushering in an authoritarian state to enforce compliance within the system. Please, stop with the r/communism talking points. MAKE YOUR OWN TALKING POINTS. WITH YOUR OWN MIND. I sincerely mean this when I say I hope you reconsider your thought on the universe some day. That is all. Communism is not inherently authoritarian. Capitalism is. I’ll leave it at that. 2 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 5 minutes ago, Patine said: I hate to be pedantic, and your point is great, but the historian in me screams out. The event in 1933 was a, "unite the far right," event, where the Black-White-Red Struggle Front (a coalition of three far-right parties without populist leaders, which included the German National People's Party (who wanted to bring back the Kaiser and the Empire Bismarck forged), Stahlhelm (a militant, revanchist party WW1 veterans), and the Agricultural League (a reactionary and highly Socially Conservative Party of big and small rural landowners) threw in their lot behind the far-right-wing, militant, incendiary, Revanchist, Volkische, Antisemitic, Antiziganist, Anti-Communist/Socialist, Authoritarian, Pan-German, etc. far-right-wing Nazi Party, under Hitler who WAS a fiery populist and dominating the polls. The far-left was the Communist Party of Germany, led by Ernst Thalmann, who never backed down to Hitler, was arrested in 1934, sent to a Concentration Camp for political dissidents, held in isolation for 10 years, then taken out an shot when the Soviets were nearing that camp to avoid him being a rallying point. Of course, Thalmann's lieutenant in the KPD, Walter Ulbricht, saw the writing on the wall, fled the country, ended up in Moscow, sucked up to Stalin good, especially after Barbarossa, and, after the war, returned and become the founder, architect, and first leader of East Germany with Stalin's full blessing and backing. I agree with your point, fully, but the pedantic historian in me has to point this out. I am comfortable saying that this, my friend is a good point and I do not find it pedantic at all unlike other times when this may devolve into a dispute. I appreciate it! I was simply making a generalization but yes, you are correct in your in depth, historian analysis! 😄 Good constructive points. Hitler always had an enemy in the other far side of the fringe anyways 😛 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenobiyl Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 20 minutes ago, Mishfox said: Communism is not inherently authoritarian. Capitalism is. I’ll leave it at that. I think this takes the cake for worst mishfox hot take in the history of this forum 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVProgressive Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 1 hour ago, Mishfox said: Communism is not inherently authoritarian. Capitalism is. I’ll leave it at that. Both Capitalism, and Marxism can manifest in Democratic, or Authoritarian governments, but unfortunately there has never been a truly democratic Marxist state, even the best ESS states during the Cold War were 'benevolent' dictatorships (Tito, Castro etc.) We've been able to see both Liberal Democratic (USA, Japan, etc.), and Illiberal Authoritarian (Pinochet's Chile, post collapse Russia etc.) Capitalist states, but we've only ever seen authoritarian Communist states. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilight Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 9 hours ago, Mishfox said: Communism is not inherently authoritarian. Capitalism is. I’ll leave it at that. Government is inherently authoritarian regardless of the economic system 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timur Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 (edited) On 6/18/2021 at 10:32 AM, DakotaHale said: King of the United American Empire: @DakotaHale Royal Press Secretary: @Patine Lord of the Midwest: @ConservativeElector2 Lord of the Midwest (disputed): @Hestia Ambassador to the Republic of Texas: @Dobs Royal Barista: @vcczar Lord of the Ohio: @MrPotatoTed Lord of Florida-men: Sir Ronald DeSantis III Secretary of Transportation: @Pringles Attorney, Judge, Jury and Executioner General: @WVProgressive Ambassador to Amazon (the forest): @Rodja Ambassador to the Technocratic Kingdom of Amazon™️: @SilentLiberty (I’ll fill out a serious one when I get a chance in a bit) Since Florida Man is in your cabinet, does Karen have a post so that she can talk to the manager? Edited June 22, 2021 by Timur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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