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Favorable or Unfavorable #440: Jon Huntsman


vcczar

Favorable or Unfavorable #440: Jon Huntsman  

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  2. 2. Favorable or Unfavorable #440: Jon Huntsman



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Jon Huntsman (UT-R) has an impressive foreign policy resume. 

In 2012, I thought he seemed like the obvious GOP nominee -- reasonable, fluent in Chinese, experienced popular governor, lots of foreign policy experienced, trustworthy, etc. Yet, he got no support. 

His actions:

Huntsman, Jon 1992 Amb to Singapore for Bush
Huntsman, Jon 2001 Declines offer by Bush to be Amb to Indonesia; considered for Amb to China
Huntsman, Jon 2007 GOPer who seems moderately comfortable with the idea of government healthcare
Huntsman, Jon 2008 Early McCain supporter gives nom speech for Sarah Palin for VP at GOP Conv
Huntsman, Jon 2009 GOPer who is Amb to China for Obama, resigning as Gov of UT (w/ 80%+ approval rating) to take the role
Huntsman, Jon 2011 GOPer who comes out in support of evolution and scientists on climate change, amid GOP departing from these views
Huntsman, Jon 2012 Rep pres cand
Huntsman, Jon 2012 Declines invited to GOP convention; urges creation of a 3rd party
Huntsman, Jon 2013 GOPer comes out in support of same-sex marriage
Huntsman, Jon 2016 Retracts endorsement of Trump during election, but often defends him
Huntsman, Jon 2017 Amb to Russia for Trump; considered for Sec of State
Huntsman, Jon 2017 GOPer who agrees with many Dems that Russia interfered in 2016 election for Trump
Huntsman, Jon 2018 Strongly considers Sen for UT bid but declines
Huntsman, Jon 2020 Popular former Gov of UT loses close primary election to win back office 11 years later
Huntsman, Jon 2024 Member of moderate No Labels Org, considered as possibility for 3rd party run for pres under that label
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I'll still say favorable, though I haven't been keeping up with him and some of the stuff here does sour me on him a bit, but probably not over the line yet (though likely because he's not currently politically relevant).

RE: 2012... I think he had a lot of trouble differentiating himself from Romney.  I do agree, he was probably the better candidate than Romney if your criteria is moderate appeal/dem appeal, but I think there was only room in the primaries for one candidate of the Romney-Huntsman mold.  The fact that Romney was the nominee in the end shows that by and large most people thought the same thing, and probably the reason Romney got the nod over Huntsman was more due to intangibles or personality.

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2 minutes ago, OrangeP47 said:

I'll still say favorable, though I haven't been keeping up with him and some of the stuff here does sour me on him a bit, but probably not over the line yet (though likely because he's not currently politically relevant).

RE: 2012... I think he had a lot of trouble differentiating himself from Romney.  I do agree, he was probably the better candidate than Romney if your criteria is moderate appeal/dem appeal, but I think there was only room in the primaries for one candidate of the Romney-Huntsman mold.  The fact that Romney was the nominee in the end shows that by and large most people thought the same thing, and probably the reason Romney got the nod over Huntsman was more due to intangibles or personality.

Just to continue because this is actually bringing me back to 2012, but the TL;DR I remember from that election (and it was the first presidential election I voted in, though not the first election in general, I was old enough in 2010), was that Huntsman was "Romney-lite".  Why would you vote for Huntsman if you could vote for Romney? While I'm pretty sure nobody I knew said those exact words, many expressed that exact sentiment.

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My favorite thing about Jon Huntsman was his intense and bitter rivalry with Mitt Romney, going back to the 2008 primary where he misled Romney about his support and ended up endorsing McCain. The antipathy between them to me is so funny and the height of the narcissism of small differences. 

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This, This to me should be the centre right. I would vote for a republican in primary, and hell if healthcare existed and normal european-like policies enacted and I was 30 as middle class. HE WOULD BE TAKE MY VOTE. but thats not whats happening, I would not be worried with him as pres.

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Got to hear him speak just after he returned from his China post, such a reasonable, measured perspective on politics and diplomacy. Easily would've gotten my vote as a Republican candidate. Now he's clearly an aberration in the trump party. Honestly, if he and other dissatisfied never trumpers and (more) moderate Democrats pooled together as an actual unit (not no labels), and contested house or state legislature elections, maybe there'd be a shot at a third party. A presidential 3rd party is useless if you don't have the grassroots and lower level reps to back it up.

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20 minutes ago, 10centjimmy said:

Got to hear him speak just after he returned from his China post, such a reasonable, measured perspective on politics and diplomacy. Easily would've gotten my vote as a Republican candidate. Now he's clearly an aberration in the trump party. Honestly, if he and other dissatisfied never trumpers and (more) moderate Democrats pooled together as an actual unit (not no labels), and contested house or state legislature elections, maybe there'd be a shot at a third party. A presidential 3rd party is useless if you don't have the grassroots and lower level reps to back it up.

Unfortunately such a party would drain more Biden support than Trump support most likely, even if the bulk of this moderate party leaders are center-right.

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58 minutes ago, vcczar said:

Unfortunately such a party would drain more Biden support than Trump support most likely, even if the bulk of this moderate party leaders are center-right.

In some races, surely, but the less "republican" voices in the house and Senate could lead to compromise- focused leadership and bills. The "majority of the majority" nonsense gets us nothing, always waiting for the next election to get the votes we need to pass "better" laws.  Missed opportunities and hyper partisanship serve no one but those who get their names in the news. 

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1 hour ago, vcczar said:

Unfortunately such a party would drain more Biden support than Trump support most likely, even if the bulk of this moderate party leaders are center-right.

I don’t think most people realize how ideologically diverse the Biden coalition is. Consider me and even a couple of others living proof. What makes me admire people like Mitt Romney and Huntsman is that I’m sure they recognize this, and what they’d be doing if they ran a third party. I’d be happy to see an actual conservative alternative to Trumps GOP, but it would almost assuredly hand Trump a win. I’ve been in the same position for almost 4 years now on this issue. Donald will never earn my vote and despite my disapproval of Bidens presidency, I’ll vote for him 2024. If any MAGAtard doesn’t like it, too bad. I wear my RINO label as a badge of honor these days.
 

Ive seen people change about Trump around me in real life. One of my good friends who is very conservative, said there is little chance that Donald will win his vote at this point because of constant promises to be a dictator if he were to win back the presidency. He already wasn’t voting for him in the primaries. But Jan 6 -> Indictments/Eventual Convictions -> Dictator promising and rhetoric, 2024 will be interesting come election night.

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13 minutes ago, Pringles said:

I don’t think most people realize how ideologically diverse the Biden coalition is. Consider me and even a couple of others living proof. What makes me admire people like Mitt Romney and Huntsman is that I’m sure they recognize this, and what they’d be doing if they ran a third party. I’d be happy to see an actual conservative alternative to Trumps GOP, but it would almost assuredly hand Trump a win. I’ve been in the same position for almost 4 years now on this issue. Donald will never earn my vote and despite my disapproval of Bidens presidency, I’ll vote for him 2024. If any MAGAtard doesn’t like it, too bad. I wear my RINO label as a badge of honor these days.
 

Ive seen people change about Trump around me in real life. One of my good friends who is very conservative, said there is little chance that Donald will win his vote at this point because of constant promises to be a dictator if he were to win back the presidency. He already wasn’t voting for him in the primaries. But Jan 6 -> Indictments/Eventual Convictions -> Dictator promising and rhetoric, 2024 will be interesting come election night.

My best friend voted for Trump in 2016 and 2020. He says he’s voting for RFK Jr in 2024. He didn’t vote in 2012. Voted Obama in 2008. Detested GW Bush. He’s basically a burn down the barn voter. He’s one of the most intelligent and creative people I know but he’s got almost no ability to reason in some areas. His top issues are vaccines and US military intervention. He’s opposed to vaccines and military intervention. He flips flops a lot. He was really pro-Israel until this recent war. Now he’s pro-Palestinian. I think his only firm conviction in politics is that he things conspiracy theories are real and that everything is a false flag and every election is rigged. Aside from this, he speaks like 12 languages and is trying to teach himself a score of more (including Navajo and Klingon), and he can play every instrument. He’s written over 2,000 songs in about every genre. Just released some sort of weird hybrid of US country + Vietnamese folk music. He’d also writing an experimental novel that uses music tones or something in helping write the novel, in the sense that vowels are like music. He’s been mostly jobless for 10 years and lives with his parents because he’s basically unhirable. Crippling anxiety and depression. He works on music for like 18 hours a day. Makes about $15 a month on it though because he’s banned on most social media outlets for spreading misinformation and is terrible at promoting it. We get in arguments when we talk about politics so we usually avoid the topic. 
 

I have another GOP friend who hasn’t voted for a Republican since the first Bush. He calls himself a Reagan Republican (sometimes a Federalist Democrat). He thinks the GOP moved away from sanity with Newt Gingrich in the 1990s and the Religious Right. He was a huge Huntsman fan. He liked Kasich in 2016.  Votes GOP in primaries and Dem in the general. 

I also have several Libertarian Republican friends that have voted Clinton and Biden over Trump, very very reluctantly so. 

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34 minutes ago, vcczar said:

My best friend voted for Trump in 2016 and 2020. He says he’s voting for RFK Jr in 2024. He didn’t vote in 2012. Voted Obama in 2008. Detested GW Bush. He’s basically a burn down the barn voter. He’s one of the most intelligent and creative people I know but he’s got almost no ability to reason in some areas. His top issues are vaccines and US military intervention. He’s opposed to vaccines and military intervention. He flips flops a lot. He was really pro-Israel until this recent war. Now he’s pro-Palestinian. I think his only firm conviction in politics is that he things conspiracy theories are real and that everything is a false flag and every election is rigged. Aside from this, he speaks like 12 languages and is trying to teach himself a score of more (including Navajo and Klingon), and he can play every instrument. He’s written over 2,000 songs in about every genre. Just released some sort of weird hybrid of US country + Vietnamese folk music. He’d also writing an experimental novel that uses music tones or something in helping write the novel, in the sense that vowels are like music. He’s been mostly jobless for 10 years and lives with his parents because he’s basically unhirable. Crippling anxiety and depression. He works on music for like 18 hours a day. Makes about $15 a month on it though because he’s banned on most social media outlets for spreading misinformation and is terrible at promoting it. We get in arguments when we talk about politics so we usually avoid the topic. 
 

I have another GOP friend who hasn’t voted for a Republican since the first Bush. He calls himself a Reagan Republican (sometimes a Federalist Democrat). He thinks the GOP moved away from sanity with Newt Gingrich in the 1990s and the Religious Right. He was a huge Huntsman fan. He liked Kasich in 2016.  Votes GOP in primaries and Dem in the general. 

I also have several Libertarian Republican friends that have voted Clinton and Biden over Trump, very very reluctantly so. 

Your best friend sounds like some people in my family. Basically, they switch tones whenever the media tells them too. 
 

“yeah I hate Russia, go Ukraine!”

*2 months of Newsmax/MAGA media ensues*

”Zelensky is a transsexual pedo, why are we sending money to him???”

 

Same thing with the recent Israel conflict. Pro Israel their entire life until Trump, Kanye, Tucker, whoever… opens their mouth. 😂

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I am torn with John Huntsman. On one hand, he was not my candidate in 2012. He was way too socially liberal  and was hard to distinguish from Romney despite having entirely different careers (it was probably their identical haircuts). However, I believe that he would have been a fantastic ticket-balancer for a more conservative nominee's VP. That being said, I would take him over the Trump Republicans any day. In the very least he brings competence and experience to the table.

5 hours ago, Pringles said:

I don’t think most people realize how ideologically diverse the Biden coalition is. Consider me and even a couple of others living proof. What makes me admire people like Mitt Romney and Huntsman is that I’m sure they recognize this, and what they’d be doing if they ran a third party. I’d be happy to see an actual conservative alternative to Trumps GOP, but it would almost assuredly hand Trump a win. I’ve been in the same position for almost 4 years now on this issue. Donald will never earn my vote and despite my disapproval of Bidens presidency, I’ll vote for him 2024. If any MAGAtard doesn’t like it, too bad. I wear my RINO label as a badge of honor these days.
 

I wouldn't classify all of the Never-Trump wing of the GOP as a part of the Biden-coalition. A lot of us see him as just as corrupt as Trump was/is. I think this is the perfect time for a third-party grow in popularity, I have my eye on the No-Labels Party and the American Solidarity Party. Perhaps the Libertarians would be able to gain relevance if they don't raid the local loony bin for candidates or choose someone who is foreign-policy illiterate.

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