vcczar Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 This list is only since Woodrow Wilson because we didn't really have huge deficit spending until World War I. In fact, Wilson was lowering the deficit before then and as he was leaving office. Teddy Roosevelt saw some deficit spending during peacetime, which was rare: Presidents since WWI by % Increase, ranked largest decrease to largest increase) Coolidge, 26% decrease Harding, 6% decrease Clinton, 1% decrease [Surpluses every year of his 2nd term] Truman, 2% increase [Impressive considering National Security spending] Eisenhower, 6% increase [Cold War and Highway--1959 saw huge increase; had 3 surplus years] JFK, 6% increase [First "peacetime" president with consistent deficit spending each year] LBJ, 11% increase [Vietnam and Great Society...had surplus last year, spent less than JFK two years] Nixon, 20% increase [Escalated Vietnam Hoover, 30% increase [Great Depression ended two years of decreases] Trump, 33% increase [Covid] Carter, 36% increase GHW Bush, 36% increase Ford, 38% increase [Probably dealing with Stagflation. Can't explain increase otherwise.] GW Bush, 57% increase [War on Terror and Great Recession] Obama, 58% increase [Great Recession and Obamacare] Reagan, 142% increase [liberal spender Ronald Reagan greatly invested in defense spending...1st time deficit in the trillions. ] FDR, 186% increase [Great Depression + WWII...1938 saw almost no increase] Wilson, 775% increase [Almost exclusively WWI-related] Note on Wilson: His % is so high because there was almost no money in the federal budget for spending. By FDR, taxes was replacing tariffs as the chief source of revenue. More money means that any increase will seem minimal %-wise as compared with Wilson's %. In FDR's time, WIlson's % would be less than FDRs] 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vcczar Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 Lincoln isn't on this list but he and possibly Grant likely increased spending greatly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaHale Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 Sad. Also one of the reasons why Bill Clinton is in my top 5 favorite Presidents. And also a big part in why Coolidge is first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 Not arguing with the statistics or anything here, but for most of Bills Presidency... guess who was in control of the House. 😛 I'm no Gingrich fan but I think connecting the dots is pretty easy here. 😛 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vcczar Posted April 21, 2021 Author Share Posted April 21, 2021 17 minutes ago, DakotaHale said: Sad. Also one of the reasons why Bill Clinton is in my top 5 favorite Presidents. And also a big part in why Coolidge is first. 12 minutes ago, Pringles said: Not arguing with the statistics or anything here, but for most of Bills Presidency... guess who was in control of the House. 😛 I'm no Gingrich fan but I think connecting the dots is pretty easy here. 😛 A lot of the deficit reduction for Clinton was cutting a lot of Cold War spending. Similarly, a lot of Harding and Coolidge's decreases had to do with cutting a lot of WWI and post-war spending. While Coolidge reduced the budget by 26%, he really needed to reduce it by over 700% to get it to pre-war spending. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaHale Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 1 minute ago, vcczar said: A lot of the deficit reduction for Clinton was cutting a lot of Cold War spending. Similarly, a lot of Harding and Coolidge's decreases had to do with cutting a lot of WWI and post-war spending. While Coolidge reduced the budget by 26%, he really needed to reduce it by over 700% to get it to pre-war spending. He also lowered over a quarter of the debt. Unheard of in Today’s America. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 I suppose this is a good thing of Slick Willy's Presidency. I usually tend to try and not let my personal feelings get too involved in my judgement of a Presidency by performance. But Willy is just as bad as Trump on a personal level. Only differing in the fact that Willy wouldn't incite an insurrection lol. Although I would've preferred if Trump actually did do something decent with the budget. 😛 This is honestly one of the reasons why I would have definitely voted for Al Gore in 2000. Probably the last Democrat I would've voted for had I been alive. He would've continued the course I believe. Unlike Bush cutting taxes on every group for political play. I like tax cuts but do it only on the middle class if you're gonna do it. 😛 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 1 minute ago, Patine said: And then George W. Bush came and drove it way back up, because war crimes, illegal wars, and police states in utter violation of Constitutional law, and well as secret facilities to engage in the barbaric, Medieval practice of TORTURE - which only sick animals who should be locked up in the same kind of facility Hannibal Lector was in Silence of the Lambs, not allowed to walk among ordinary people - actually engage in, conduct, or ORDER FROM ON HIGH, and that any civilized nation or government condemns universally under all circumstances. Don't get me wrong here, I don't condone torture but those bastards that flew planes into the Twin Towers deserved whatever they had coming to them. And yes, you say this a lot. Iraq was bad, endless wars are bad, I agree. Police state is also bad, although I'm not much of a wrongdoer so I don't think too much of it unlike some people. I have an epic tool called a VPN. Tis' the risk we all take by being on the internet after all. Maybe some people should go off the grid 😛 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaHale Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 26 minutes ago, Pringles said: Don't get me wrong here, I don't condone torture but those bastards that flew planes into the Twin Towers deserved whatever they had coming to them. And yes, you say this a lot. Iraq was bad, endless wars are bad, I agree. Police state is also bad, although I'm not much of a wrongdoer so I don't think too much of it unlike some people. I have an epic tool called a VPN. Tis' the risk we all take by being on the internet after all. Maybe some people should go off the grid 😛 That’s the plan. Want to hook buy a cabin in middle America and retire early 30s. All I need is internet access, dog and a cabinet full of liquor and cigars to be happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 3 minutes ago, DakotaHale said: That’s the plan. Want to hook buy a cabin in middle America and retire early 30s. All I need is internet access, dog and a cabinet full of liquor and cigars to be happy. You sound like my dad. Except he'd be in his 60s when he'd want to do that. 😛 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaHale Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 3 minutes ago, Pringles said: You sound like my dad. Except he'd be in his 60s when he'd want to do that. 😛 Nothing wrong with that. Working and supporting your family is honest and one of the most American things there is 🇺🇸 But so is not paying taxes and chilling in the woods making bootlegged moonshine and illegal firearms. 😎🇺🇸 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 Just now, DakotaHale said: Nothing wrong with that. Working and supporting your family is honest and one of the most American things there is 🇺🇸 But so is not paying taxes and chilling in the woods making bootlegged moonshine and illegal firearms. 😎🇺🇸 Amen 😎 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rezi Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 20 minutes ago, Patine said: If I may ask, how is this endeavour, dating back to AT LEAST the beginning of recorded human history as a major priority in so many lives, a signature "American," thing? God Bless America! 🇺🇸 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaHale Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 31 minutes ago, Patine said: If I may ask, how is this endeavour, dating back to AT LEAST the beginning of recorded human history as a major priority in so many lives, a signature "American," thing? Proven by the amount of amazing people who come here in search of a better life (the most immigrated to country for decades, probably a century). The amount of immigrants who work here and send money back to their families. The way NYC got back on its feet after the worst terrorist attack in 60 years by getting to work and rebuilding the city back to the worlds de facto economic center. We’re not perfect by any means, but I think America is the greatest country in the history of the world. There’s more we can do to make sure this country can create equality of opportunity for everyone, but even then the amount of opportunity and class mobility here is unreal to those who put their minds to success and work hard and I wouldn’t choose to live anywhere else. I love this country and its people. 🇺🇸🇺🇸 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaHale Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 2 minutes ago, Patine said: These are admirable traits of a nation in many books and by many standards - but have nothing to do with a preferential blessing and view of it by God. Especially as it's home to very large number of Wolves in Sheep's Clothing Amongst the Flock, and commits a lot of evil and wickedness while using the Lord's Name in Vain. Was replying to your other comment about work being an American thing but I don’t disagree with this. I think Gods people and influence reach around the world for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaHale Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 5 minutes ago, Patine said: Also, this part of the nation's pedigree was killed several decades ago by big corporations and their plutocratic control of everything of meaning - including the Federal Government. The American Dream has been replaced by a Corporatist Neo-Feudal Dystopia. Only those in the corporatist inner circles, those allowed to advance to such heights by them, or those who pursue startups in niche industries that take off became among the rich and successful - it's not merely hard work anymore, as shown by the many who live and die poor, even after lives of dedicated work. A new social stratification replaced the old class mobility the nation was famous for. You don’t have to make millions to be successful in America. I think someone’s goal of having children, working in their 60s to support those children, and retiring later in life to give back to the world is just as noble as my desire to retire early and child free in my 30s. America provides those opportunities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaHale Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 3 minutes ago, Patine said: I was asking about how, "working and supporting your family," was a signature American thing above other nations, especially with rapid deterioration of family life and work ethic in the United States in general, but these values remaining strong for centuries in many Third World countries. Sure, but I think America is the best place to be rewarded for your hard work. Especially if you take big risks to achieve success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVProgressive Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 45 minutes ago, Patine said: Which God are you invoking? The Abrahamic God, the Father of Christ and Lord in Heaven, is not a nationalist, and not bless one nation over another since the New Covenant. Which pagan god of olde and yore are calling upon for that blessing? Praise Goddess Athena, patron of Democracy, for providing America to the world as inspiration, and providing us all the blessings she can bestow upon us, her loyal servants, and worshipers, so that we may triumph over the forces of darkness, both at home, and abroad. 😛 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, WVProgressive said: Praise Goddess Athena, patron of Democracy, for providing America to the world as inspiration, and providing us all the blessings she can bestow upon us, her loyal servants, and worshipers, so that we may triumph over the forces of darkness, both at home, and abroad. 😛 Hail Athena! We shall crush the forces of Hades. For we are the sons of Mars!!! Wait... I just mixed Roman and Greek mythology didnt I? 😛 Edited April 22, 2021 by Pringles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rezi Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Patine said: Which God are you invoking? The Abrahamic God, the Father of Christ and Lord in Heaven, is not a nationalist, and not bless one nation over another since the New Covenant. Which pagan god of olde and yore are calling upon for that blessing? Myself! I am my own personal god and choose to invoke myself! God Bless America! 🇺🇸 Edited April 22, 2021 by Rezi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVProgressive Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 5 minutes ago, Patine said: Athenian Democracy allowed every citizen a direct vote on every issue, and the right to debate and propose laws directly with no intermediary of pesky, untrustworthy, corrupt, overreaching, and power-abusive elected political representatives. The Republic was Plato's brainchild, and his piety and conformity to Greek Polytheism (or any religion) was suspect and dubious. 😛 Let me admit at the start, that I am a believer in the divinity of Athena, and various other deities, that they bestow favor upon certain societies, and people, and that the favor, and even beliefs of these deities is subject to some change, and not a static, hard, and fast set of mandates the same from creation to Armageddon. With that out of the way I don't think Athena really cares about the specifics of the Democracy she's blessing, so long as it is indeed a Democracy. Yes she blessed the Athenians, but she also blessed various proto-Democratic societies before hand. I also believe that Athena blessed the Roman Republic, before Caesar came around, and established an Empire, and that she gave blessing to many other Democratic movements, reformers, and societies before the rise of America. We also have to remember that Athens was not a model of 'true Democracy' itself, as they had slaves which, obviously, were not allowed to vote, which is rather un-Democratic, to just disallow an entire group of people from voting, at all. I'm not saying America is a 'true Democracy' either, mind you, but I do believe that, as the world's most powerful Democratic state, Athena has given her blessing to America, while also chastising us for our failings, as she did to the Athenians, Romans, and countless others before us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVProgressive Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 1 minute ago, Patine said: A counter-point on Athena, specifically. She was also the Goddess of, "just and wise war." That does that sum up the American military ideal at all to you? Not being accusatory, here, but giving more food for thought. No, it doesn't, and as I said, Athena chastises us for or failings, and we must do better. Every bomb dropped on a civilian from a predator drone, every soldier killed in a desert, in a war fought over oil, every child left orphaned due to an unjust, and stupid war, if an affront to humanity, and an affront to Athena. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DakotaHale Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 27 minutes ago, WVProgressive said: Let me admit at the start, that I am a believer in the divinity of Athena, and various other deities, that they bestow favor upon certain societies, and people, and that the favor, and even beliefs of these deities is subject to some change, and not a static, hard, and fast set of mandates the same from creation to Armageddon. With that out of the way I don't think Athena really cares about the specifics of the Democracy she's blessing, so long as it is indeed a Democracy. Yes she blessed the Athenians, but she also blessed various proto-Democratic societies before hand. I also believe that Athena blessed the Roman Republic, before Caesar came around, and established an Empire, and that she gave blessing to many other Democratic movements, reformers, and societies before the rise of America. We also have to remember that Athens was not a model of 'true Democracy' itself, as they had slaves which, obviously, were not allowed to vote, which is rather un-Democratic, to just disallow an entire group of people from voting, at all. I'm not saying America is a 'true Democracy' either, mind you, but I do believe that, as the world's most powerful Democratic state, Athena has given her blessing to America, while also chastising us for our failings, as she did to the Athenians, Romans, and countless others before us. I cannot tell if this is a 4D-chess level troll or if you’re being serious. Either way it’s interesting and I can’t say I’ve seen any other modern disciples of Greek religion personally! Is it just Greek deities or do you have faith in any other ones? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.