Timur Posted September 19, 2021 Share Posted September 19, 2021 . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timur Posted September 19, 2021 Author Share Posted September 19, 2021 40 minutes ago, Patine said: This would be a tough one. I'm dubious of Macron, all-in-all, I would definitely NOT endorse La Pen or other far-right-wing, ultra-nationalist, xenophobic, reactionaries, but, in France's case, the PS, which might be my normal choice, is tainted by the legacy of Francois Mitterand, who is still greatly honoured in the party's ranks - given I have a Rwandan-Canadian friend and know the horrid, heinous, and unforgiveable role France had in protecting, aiding, and supporting Interahamwe militia-gangs and others perpetrating genocide there, and using their veto to end the UN mission - under, specifically, Mitterand's Presidency, and then Mitterand claimed that now-Rwandan President Paul Kagame and his RPF (the Tutsi-dominated militia that came from Uganda and actually ended the genocide), were the sole criminals in the affair, and signature figures in conducting the brutal bloodbath STILL have political assylum given them by Mitterand in France. I could not support the PS in France anymore than I could give true support for any politician who had been part of George W. Bush's Administration or support base in Congress in the U.S. - which is one of the big reasons my support would have gone Third Party in 2016 and 2020, despite colourfully-worded denunciations of that viewpoint a couple of months ago by @vcczar. How do you view Melanchon or the EELV (European Ecology - The Greens)? Or the smaller parties? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted September 19, 2021 Share Posted September 19, 2021 3 minutes ago, Patine said: Action Francais No... When it comes to my view of French politics I'm actually pretty similar to your own outlook on the rest of the world! 😛 Meaning I think it all sucks. I hate Le Pen, I strongly dislike Macron. If things get close I'd vote for Macron in a Le Pen vs Macron matchup. But I'm happy just writing someone in, a local candidate, or an independent of whatever. Now that you mention Napoleon though... yes... yessssssss, I'd gladly vote for him! 😈😛 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobs Posted September 19, 2021 Share Posted September 19, 2021 2 hours ago, Pringles said: No... When it comes to my view of French politics I'm actually pretty similar to your own outlook on the rest of the world! 😛 Meaning I think it all sucks. I hate Le Pen, I strongly dislike Macron. If things get close I'd vote for Macron in a Le Pen vs Macron matchup. But I'm happy just writing someone in, a local candidate, or an independent of whatever. Now that you mention Napoleon though... yes... yessssssss, I'd gladly vote for him! 😈😛 Im surprised by your hesitance to support LR. Bertrand is no Fillon but he’s the best alternative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pringles Posted September 19, 2021 Share Posted September 19, 2021 1 hour ago, Dobs said: Im surprised by your hesitance to support LR. Bertrand is no Fillon but he’s the best alternative. Dont know much about him other than what Ed has told me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timur Posted September 20, 2021 Author Share Posted September 20, 2021 11 hours ago, Patine said: This would be a tough one. I'm dubious of Macron, all-in-all, I would definitely NOT endorse La Pen or other far-right-wing, ultra-nationalist, xenophobic, reactionaries, but, in France's case, the PS, which might be my normal choice, is tainted by the legacy of Francois Mitterand, who is still greatly honoured in the party's ranks - given I have a Rwandan-Canadian friend and know the horrid, heinous, and unforgiveable role France had in protecting, aiding, and supporting Interahamwe militia-gangs and others perpetrating genocide there, and using their veto to end the UN mission - under, specifically, Mitterand's Presidency, and then Mitterand claimed that now-Rwandan President Paul Kagame and his RPF (the Tutsi-dominated militia that came from Uganda and actually ended the genocide), were the sole criminals in the affair, and signature figures in conducting the brutal bloodbath STILL have political assylum given them by Mitterand in France. I could not support the PS in France anymore than I could give true support for any politician who had been part of George W. Bush's Administration or support base in Congress in the U.S. - which is one of the big reasons my support would have gone Third Party in 2016 and 2020, despite colourfully-worded denunciations of that viewpoint a couple of months ago by @vcczar. Interesting thing is that recent news has come out that the Australian government knew of a massacre of peaceful protesters of the Free Papua Movement by the Indonesian military... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edouard Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 12 hours ago, Patine said: This would be a tough one. I'm dubious of Macron, all-in-all, I would definitely NOT endorse La Pen or other far-right-wing, ultra-nationalist, xenophobic, reactionaries, but, in France's case, the PS, which might be my normal choice, is tainted by the legacy of Francois Mitterand, who is still greatly honoured in the party's ranks - given I have a Rwandan-Canadian friend and know the horrid, heinous, and unforgiveable role France had in protecting, aiding, and supporting Interahamwe militia-gangs and others perpetrating genocide there, and using their veto to end the UN mission - under, specifically, Mitterand's Presidency, and then Mitterand claimed that now-Rwandan President Paul Kagame and his RPF (the Tutsi-dominated militia that came from Uganda and actually ended the genocide), were the sole criminals in the affair, and signature figures in conducting the brutal bloodbath STILL have political assylum given them by Mitterand in France. I could not support the PS in France anymore than I could give true support for any politician who had been part of George W. Bush's Administration or support base in Congress in the U.S. - which is one of the big reasons my support would have gone Third Party in 2016 and 2020, despite colourfully-worded denunciations of that viewpoint a couple of months ago by @vcczar. As of right now as someone able to vote (and who voted Hamon in 2017) I would vote Macron first for 2022 I had a big, very very big disagreement with Macron on military service, but MPs have reduced this in parliament so now that this is behind I am more confortable voting for him again. France 2022 is really open First because Emmanuel Macron is divisive but not unpopular (nor popular) The left is divided into pieces but did well during midterm elections To the contrary, the Rassemblement National (Le Pen's party) collapsed during midterm elections They lost a lot of towns during mayoral elections Same during 2021 regional elections In comparision here was the result of the last regional election of 2015 FN is the old name of RN before 2017 So France is at a crossroad time of political change There is no longer any major party, only fractions and even Le Pen's party suffers from it This guy also threatens Le Pen a lot for 2022 https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/17/world/europe/zemmour-france-presidency-trump.html He could barely take Marine le Pen out of the runoff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edouard Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 Last polls say this E. Macron 25% M. Le Pen 18% X. Bertrand 15% Eric Zemmour 8% J.L. Mélenchon 8% Y. Jadot 7% Anne Hidalgo 7% N. Dupont Aignant 4% A. Montebourg 2% F. Roussel (communiste) 2% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodja Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 12 hours ago, Patine said: @Rodja, are you aware of the evil and criminal legacy of Mitterand and his support, aiding, abetting, and protection of those who perpetrated and conducted the Rwandan Genocide while French President, and the fact that the PS still honours and holds in esteem Mitterand, when you chose PS as your choice, if I may ask? Im not aware of it but still PS seems like the best of options listed.Only candidates i could consider are Hidalgo,Melenchon and Jadot.Melenchon is a left wing nationalist who would leave EU and NATO and i cannot support someone like that,and i just like Hidalgo more than Jadot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edouard Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Rodja said: Im not aware of it but still PS seems like the best of options listed.Only candidates i could consider are Hidalgo,Melenchon and Jadot.Melenchon is a left wing nationalist who would leave EU and NATO and i cannot support someone like that,and i just like Hidalgo more than Jadot I don't like Mélenchon a lot 😄 But to give what is his european line it's something like that : "We will ask others countries to modify treaties to make of the EU a more "social" union, if we don't get what we want we will leave or make a referendum on leaving the EU" Btw the EU is really shifting to the left in terms of social policies without Mélenchon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Pillar_of_Social_Rights Jadot is facing a tough primary, he could be defeated in the runoff The Green primary was today Jadot came ahead with 27% of the vote but Sandrine Rousseau is threatening him with 25% of the vote and a way more radical ecologist line 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvikings1 Posted September 20, 2021 Share Posted September 20, 2021 Nicolas Dupont-Aignan (Debout la France) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVProgressive Posted September 21, 2021 Share Posted September 21, 2021 8 minutes ago, Patine said: I've heard the party name before, and seen an image of their logo. What's their platform? From an incredibly brief glance, it seems to be a French Nationalist, Gaullist, Anti-EU, and Right-Wing Populist party. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvikings1 Posted September 21, 2021 Share Posted September 21, 2021 2 hours ago, Patine said: I've heard the party name before, and seen an image of their logo. What's their platform? Very Eurosceptic (and anti-Euro); That's the biggest thing. He teamed up with Nigel Farage on a few things. Not the greatest on economic views but better than other Eurosceptic options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edouard Posted September 21, 2021 Share Posted September 21, 2021 8 hours ago, WVProgressive said: From an incredibly brief glance, it seems to be a French Nationalist, Gaullist, Anti-EU, and Right-Wing Populist party. It's kind of this yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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