Jump to content
The Political Lounge

CE2's 1788 election

ConservativeElector2

By ConservativeElector2
in Forum Games

 Share

Who would you vote for?  

16 members have voted

  1. 1. Who would you vote for? (Select only TWO)

    • George Washington - Actinguy
      9
    • Amos Singletary - Dobs
      1
    • Thomas Jefferson - Pringles
      5
    • John Hancock - Hestia
      1
    • Alexander Hamilton - Zenobiyl
      5
    • Samuel Adams - Sean F Kennedy
      1
    • Thomas Paine - WVProgressive
      3
    • Benjamin Lincoln - Cal
      1
    • John Adams - Conservative Elector 2
      2

  2. 2. Who would you vote for (Senate)?

    • Federalists
      10
    • Anti-Federalists (soon Democratic-Republicans)
      6

  3. 3. Who would you vote for (House)?

    • Federalists
      9
    • Anti-Federalists (soon Democratic-Republicans)
      7

This poll is closed to new votes

  • Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.
  • Poll closed on 05/22/2021 at 12:48 PM

Recommended Posts

Zenobiyl

Zenobiyl

Posted
Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Patine said:

You'd think Hamilton would concede to Adams, realistically. I can't see any scenario where he'd concede to Jefferson. The 1796 VP thing, that led to the famous duel, was only because the choice was strictly between Jefferson and Burr, and he found Burr unbearable. Otherwise, I can't see such a thing, to be honest. The men were far too much at odds.

Jefferson tied for second place, so he won after Hamilton was disqualified

Edited by Zenobiyl
Link to comment
Share on other sites
MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, ConservativeElector2 said:

Hereby I declare George Washington @MrPotatoTed to the first President of the United States. (I just noticed I called you still Actinguy in the post lol). President Washington please name your first cabinet and your first six Supreme Court justices. I believe you need a State, Treasury, War Secy and a Attorney General.

Thomas Jefferson @Pringles is declared to be the nation's first Vice President  (as we found out Hamilton was an illegitimate candidate due to being too young to run for President)

PRESIDENT: @MrPotatoTed George Washington, Virginia
VICE PRESIDENT: @Pringles Thomas Jefferson, Virginia

SECRETARY OF STATE: @ConservativeElector2 John Adams, Massachusetts
SECRETARY OF TREASURY: Henry Laurens, South Carolina
SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Samuel Blachley Webb, Connecticut
ATTORNEY GENERAL: @Zenobiyl Alexander Hamilton, New York

CHIEF JUSTICE: John Jay, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: @Sean F Kennedy Samuel Adams, Massachusetts
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: John Marshall, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Henry Brockholst Livingston, New York
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Thomas Pinckney, South Carolina
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: George Wythe, Virginia

Edited by MrPotatoTed
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Pringles

Pringles

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, MrPotatoTed said:

PRESIDENT: @MrPotatoTed George Washington, Virginia
VICE PRESIDENT: @Pringles Thomas Jefferson, Virginia

SECRETARY OF STATE: @ConservativeElector2 John Adams, Massachusetts
SECRETARY OF TREASURY: Henry Laurens, South Carolina
SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Samuel Blachley Webb, Connecticut
ATTORNEY GENERAL: @Zenobiyl Alexander Hamilton, New York

CHIEF JUSTICE: John Jay, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: @Sean F Kennedy Samuel Adams, Massachusetts
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: John Marshall, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Henry Brockholst Livingston, New York
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Thomas Pinckney, South Carolina
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: George Wythe, Virginia

Vice President Jefferson expresses utmost confidence in President Washington's cabinet in a public forum. Even if he has qualms with Alexander Hamilton, and multiple Supreme Court picks. He keeps it to himself for now. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Zenobiyl

Zenobiyl

Posted
Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, MrPotatoTed said:

PRESIDENT: @MrPotatoTed George Washington, Virginia
VICE PRESIDENT: @Pringles Thomas Jefferson, Virginia

SECRETARY OF STATE: @ConservativeElector2 John Adams, Massachusetts
SECRETARY OF TREASURY: Henry Laurens, South Carolina
SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Samuel Blachley Webb, Connecticut
ATTORNEY GENERAL: @Zenobiyl Alexander Hamilton, New York

CHIEF JUSTICE: John Jay, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: @Sean F Kennedy Samuel Adams, Massachusetts
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: John Marshall, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Henry Brockholst Livingston, New York
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Thomas Pinckney, South Carolina
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: George Wythe, Virginia

Federalists are quite unhappy with a southern slaver like Henry Laurens being promoted for the cabinet. However, Alexander Hamilton uses his influence to win them over on account of his personal friendship with his son John Laurens.  

Edited by Zenobiyl
Link to comment
Share on other sites
MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Patine said:

Do all of these justices have legal credentials and past the bar, even the Colonial one, of their home state? I know Marshall did (famously), but what about the rest? 🧐

There's actually no requirement that a Supreme Court Justice has to be an attorney, even today.

Off the top of my head, I think the only one on my list not specifically trained in law was Sam Adams.  The rest were all pretty well known attorneys and or professors of law.

Edited by MrPotatoTed
Link to comment
Share on other sites
MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Zenobiyl said:

Federalists are quite unhappy with a southern slaver like Henry Laurens being promoted for the cabinet. However, Alexander Hamilton uses his influence to win them over on account of his personal friendship with his brother John Laurens.  

Son, actually.  But glad to have the support!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
WVProgressive

WVProgressive

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, Zenobiyl said:

Federalists are quite unhappy with a southern slaver like Henry Laurens being promoted for the cabinet. However, Alexander Hamilton uses his influence to win them over on account of his personal friendship with his son John Laurens.  

Henry Laurens was one of the biggest Federalists in the state of Virginia...

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sean F Kennedy

Sean F Kennedy

Posted
Posted
34 minutes ago, MrPotatoTed said:

PRESIDENT: @MrPotatoTed George Washington, Virginia
VICE PRESIDENT: @Pringles Thomas Jefferson, Virginia

SECRETARY OF STATE: @ConservativeElector2 John Adams, Massachusetts
SECRETARY OF TREASURY: Henry Laurens, South Carolina
SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Samuel Blachley Webb, Connecticut
ATTORNEY GENERAL: @Zenobiyl Alexander Hamilton, New York

CHIEF JUSTICE: John Jay, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: @Sean F Kennedy Samuel Adams, Massachusetts
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: John Marshall, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Henry Brockholst Livingston, New York
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Thomas Pinckney, South Carolina
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: George Wythe, Virginia

Samuel Adams graciously accepts the appointment 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, Patine said:

You're kidding me, right? I thought the selection process was bad enough, with the decision being made solely by politicians, and almost always having political ideology and partisan spoils and patronage and over competence and merit as de facto selling points? But they don't even have to be attorneys? I had no idea the standards were THAT slipshod. That's something else that should be added in the Court Nomination Reform thread from a month or two, ago. In fact, that's downright frightening and criminally negligent of the Philadelphia Convention not to address, and every Administration thereafter to just ignore. I'm reminded of the monstrous village quarters-sessions courts of Medieval England as a theoretically real possibility. 🥵 

Yep, it’s true.  There’s actually no qualifications listed at all, for Supreme Court justices.  My 8 year old daughter could serve as a Supreme Court Justice tomorrow, if she were nominated by the President and confirmed by the Senate.

 

Though, to be clear, every Supreme Court Justice in US history was, in fact, a trained attorney.  
 

They just don’t “have” to be.

Edited by MrPotatoTed
Link to comment
Share on other sites
MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
Posted
31 minutes ago, WVProgressive said:

Henry Laurens was one of the biggest Federalists in the state of Virginia...

He’s from South Carolina.  It’s possible maybe you’re thinking of someone else.

 

Laurens was indeed a huge supporter of the revolutionary war, but I can’t find specific mentions of whether he was federalist or antifederalist (other than the assumptions that come with being a slave owner).

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Patine said:

The potential problems and issues are still frightening, even if only hypothetically. Especially because the nomination and confirmation process needs no approval, and locks out input, from the general public, and, even if a very incompetent and/or unpopular - even repugnant - choice is made, voting out the President and Senators behind that appointment doesn't even force the aberrant Justice's retirement or stepping-down. A system that SHOULD have been thought out better in the first place, and REALLY needs fixing. Especially since the political tenor of the nation and it's social and cultural zeitgeist is declining, those hypothetical concerns may very well BECOME reality...

I don’t disagree.  To be clear, I’m not saying that there SHOULDN’T be such a requirement.  I’m just saying there isn’t.

But one thing to keep in mind was the requirement that at least 9 of the states had to ratify the constitution for it to go into effect, and really anything less than 13 was asking for trouble.

This required a lot of compromise.  Read through the constitution sometime, you’ll be surprised at how vague a lot of it is.  There’s a lot of stuff that is “to be decided by the states” and even more “to be decided by the Senate”, etc.  This helped the constitution to ultimately be ratified by every state, rather than crumbling over disagreements on how, for example, and elector for the electoral college is actually appointed (decided by each state).

 

The constitution doesn’t specify qualifications for the Supreme Court because it leaves that to the Senate to decide.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites
WVProgressive

WVProgressive

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, MrPotatoTed said:

He’s from South Carolina.  It’s possible maybe you’re thinking of someone else.

 

Laurens was indeed a huge supporter of the revolutionary war, but I can’t find specific mentions of whether he was federalist or antifederalist (other than the assumptions that come with being a slave owner).

It seems I have indeed mistaken him for someone else, as I can't find anything concrete to back up my claim of his being a Federalist, other than the fact @vcczarlabelled him a Federalist for his 1789 scenario in PI. However, since he was a large merchant, and most merchants were supporters of the Federalists, it likely that he at least had some Federalist leanings. That said, I'm willing to admit that I was wrong, and will not try to salvage a half victory on this matter, and I thank you for correcting me on my mistake.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ConservativeElector2

ConservativeElector2

Posted
  • Author
Posted
1 hour ago, MrPotatoTed said:

PRESIDENT: @MrPotatoTed George Washington, Virginia
VICE PRESIDENT: @Pringles Thomas Jefferson, Virginia

SECRETARY OF STATE: @ConservativeElector2 John Adams, Massachusetts
SECRETARY OF TREASURY: Henry Laurens, South Carolina
SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Samuel Blachley Webb, Connecticut
ATTORNEY GENERAL: @Zenobiyl Alexander Hamilton, New York

CHIEF JUSTICE: John Jay, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: @Sean F Kennedy Samuel Adams, Massachusetts
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: John Marshall, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Henry Brockholst Livingston, New York
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Thomas Pinckney, South Carolina
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: George Wythe, Virginia

I requested a rolls thread now on discord, so if we can confirm the cabinet within an hour so, I can set up the 1792 announcement thread today. 

If so, you guys can think already about challenging or backing Washington and Jefferson for their seats 😉 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Zenobiyl

Zenobiyl

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, ConservativeElector2 said:

I requested a rolls thread now on discord, so if we can confirm the cabinet within an hour so, I can set up the 1792 announcement thread today. 

If so, you guys can think already about challenging or backing Washington and Jefferson for their seats 😉 

Personally I’ll follow Washington’s lead because he’s such a chad. But once he’s gone I’m coming back.

  • Haha 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ConservativeElector2

ConservativeElector2

Posted
  • Author
Posted
2 hours ago, MrPotatoTed said:

PRESIDENT: @MrPotatoTed George Washington, Virginia
VICE PRESIDENT: @Pringles Thomas Jefferson, Virginia

SECRETARY OF STATE: @ConservativeElector2 John Adams, Massachusetts
SECRETARY OF TREASURY: Henry Laurens, South Carolina
SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Samuel Blachley Webb, Connecticut
ATTORNEY GENERAL: @Zenobiyl Alexander Hamilton, New York

CHIEF JUSTICE: John Jay, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: @Sean F Kennedy Samuel Adams, Massachusetts
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: John Marshall, Virginia
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Henry Brockholst Livingston, New York
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: Thomas Pinckney, South Carolina
ASSOCIATE JUSTICE: George Wythe, Virginia

As things stand now people are confirmed if they roll something between 11 and 100.

All are confirmed, so you are safe for this. The closest was Laurens with a die of 12.

 

So now on to death and early retirement rolls. If they roll 1-5 they are out.

No one did that, closest was Chief Justice Jay with an 8.

Sir, you have assembled an amazing first cabinet, which serves you delicately during your term.

Please make up your mind, if you'll run for re-election in 1792. I will have put up the thread shortly.

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Zenobiyl

Zenobiyl

Posted
Posted
Just now, ConservativeElector2 said:

As things stand now people are confirmed if they roll something between 11 and 100.

All are confirmed, so you are safe for this. The closest was Laurens with a die of 12.

 

So now on to death and early retirement rolls. If they roll 1-5 they are out.

No one did that, closest was Chief Justice Jay with an 8.

Sir, you have assembled an amazing first cabinet, which serves you delicately during your term.

Please make up your mind, if you'll run for re-election in 1792. I will have put up the thread shortly.

 

For RP purposes we can say Laurens barely survived a filibuster thanks to Hamilton’s support 😁

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites
MrPotatoTed

MrPotatoTed

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, ConservativeElector2 said:

As things stand now people are confirmed if they roll something between 11 and 100.

All are confirmed, so you are safe for this. The closest was Laurens with a die of 12.

 

So now on to death and early retirement rolls. If they roll 1-5 they are out.

No one did that, closest was Chief Justice Jay with an 8.

Sir, you have assembled an amazing first cabinet, which serves you delicately during your term.

Please make up your mind, if you'll run for re-election in 1792. I will have put up the thread shortly.

 

Sure, Washington's having a nice and easy Presidency.  Might as well keep it going!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
vcczar

vcczar

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, MrPotatoTed said:

He’s from South Carolina.  It’s possible maybe you’re thinking of someone else.

 

Laurens was indeed a huge supporter of the revolutionary war, but I can’t find specific mentions of whether he was federalist or antifederalist (other than the assumptions that come with being a slave owner).

 

1 hour ago, WVProgressive said:

It seems I have indeed mistaken him for someone else, as I can't find anything concrete to back up my claim of his being a Federalist, other than the fact @vcczarlabelled him a Federalist for his 1789 scenario in PI. However, since he was a large merchant, and most merchants were supporters of the Federalists, it likely that he at least had some Federalist leanings. That said, I'm willing to admit that I was wrong, and will not try to salvage a half victory on this matter, and I thank you for correcting me on my mistake.

South Carolina was HEAVILY Federalist until about 1796 and many stayed on up to about 1812. VP nominee Thomas Pinckney, and two-time Federalist nominee CC Pinckney were both SC Federalists. The Rutledges, one of which was briefly Chief Justice, also Federalists. Henry Laurens Federalists. 

I'd argue that all the states were majority federalist in 1788 with GA, PA, NY, VA, NC as the closest to mixed. In 1796, only GA and NC were clearly not Federalist, with every state except VT, MA, CT, DE, RI being mixed. The last two Federalist states were DE and MA, but Chief Justice John Marshall of VA was the last notable Federalist.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
 Share
Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...